Mike Sandford is a Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt, an active professional MMA fighter and a coach of successful fighters. He moved to Mississippi in 2010 to cover jiu-jitsu classes for what was supposed to be two weeks. By the time the gym's owner got back, the class had doubled, and Mike was hired full-time. He went on to manage the gym, became head coach and then a partner, and eventually bought the whole business. He now runs two locations.
His kids program is what sets him apart. Mike teaches modern MMA-based martial arts, not a traditional curriculum, and still competes with the biggest kids schools in his market. Red Belt Podcast host Brian "Barn Cat" Debes calls Mike's kids intro lesson the best he has ever seen. Mike puts the two-visit close rate at well over 80%, and he has had months with a 100% close rate on kids.
The Intro Lesson, Step by Step
It starts before the child steps on the mat, with an interview sheet that lists benefits parents can check off, from discipline to fitness. It handles objections early and covers value a short lesson can't fit in. Then the instructor takes over:
- The missed high five. Mike introduces himself, asks for a high five and pulls his hand away. He does it again, then lets the child land the third one, joking that "you've got to be quick to catch a ninja." He says this is the most important step because it gets almost every child smiling and ready to learn.
- Listening positions. "Attention" means standing with feet together and hands at the sides. "Lock it up" means sitting cross-legged with hands on knees. Both get a loud "yes sir," and "eyes on who?" gets "eyes on you!" When parents see their child respond like that within minutes, they're usually sold.
- A few real skills. Fighting stance, jab and cross with distance control, a front kick taught as a "bug stomp," then a single-leg takedown into mount. Mike frames it in a way that works for both parents: the child wins the fight by holding the other kid down instead of bloodying their nose, so dads see their kid win and moms see it handled without violence.
- The board break. This is the "confidence" half of a two-part white belt test. Mike pre-frames the white belt as what makes a child an "official martial artist" who can learn the more advanced moves.
- The homework close. The second half of the test happens at home. The child rates their room on a scale from F-minus to A-plus, then promises to get it to an A-plus on Mom's scale. Only then do they earn the white belt. One father texted Mike that his son came home, disappeared into his room and came out half an hour later with it spotless.
The whole lesson takes about 10 minutes. Mike keeps it short on purpose. In his words: "Nobody can keep a five-year-old's attention for an hour."
Adapting by Age, Family and Space
The private intro works best once kids reach the "age of reason," around seven or eight. Shy four- and five-year-olds are invited to watch a group class, where the closing game usually pulls them in, and get the intro on their next visit. Mike never tries to sign up a child who didn't participate.
Siblings go through the intro together, and younger kids often do better with an older sibling there. When a parent needs to talk to their spouse, Mike offers a $29 two-class paid trial that comes off the membership, so the family has some skin in the game.
Space isn't an excuse to skip the intro. Mike stands inexpensive accordion-style folding mats on end as partitions to make a private corner during busy classes. He admits that when he's away, staff tend to just put newcomers into class and close rates fall, so he's going back to scheduled intros for everyone.
Adult Intros: Let Them Feel It
For fitness kickboxing, Mike holds pads and finishes with a "knockout": the student lands a hard right, Mike drops, and the student throws ground punches until they're exhausted. Then he asks whether it's what they're looking for and goes over the options, starting with paid-in-full.
For select adult jiu-jitsu prospects, he uses an approach he credits to Brandon McCaghren: the student starts in mount and tries to punch him while Mike escapes and takes the back. He uses it only where it fits, since it can seem condescending to people with prior training. His interview questions cover how long they've wanted to train, what stopped them before, whether their partner supports it, and which class times they can commit to.
Live Training From Day One, Even at Age Two
Mike now coaches every group, including kids, more like his fight team. He has cut most old-school drilling and fills classes with live positional work that ends in rolling. For a half guard week, kids start with an underhook, head in the chest and a hip out, and the goal is simply to come up to their base. Mike calls this starting "close to the finish line," an idea from Rob Gray's book on skill acquisition. Kids get comfortable winning from a good position, then learn how to reach it, getting hundreds of reps in a couple of rounds.
The same approach runs all the way down to his weekly class for two- and three-year-olds, where kids work with a parent on single legs and holding "backpack" and mount while the parent tries to shake them off. You don't teach a toddler to walk by describing it, Mike points out. You just let them try.
Family Pricing Without Getting Taken Advantage Of
Mike wants whole families training, so he keeps the top family price well under $400 a month and makes extra members very cheap or free past a certain number. He protects the offer: one person pays, everyone lives in the same household, and it isn't heavily advertised. Brian warns that big group sign-ups can fill a class and spread instructor attention thin.
Key Takeaways
- ✓Use an interview sheet before every intro so parents have already thought through the program's benefits.
- ✓Lead with connection: the missed high five and the listening positions do more selling than any technique.
- ✓End every kids intro with a board break and a homework close tied to earning the white belt.
- ✓Bring very young or shy kids to a group class first, and don't try to close a child who never got on the mat.
- ✓Don't let busy schedules or staff habits replace the intro lesson. Partition a corner of the mat if you have to.
- ✓Build classes around live positional training that starts kids close to the finish line.
Listen to the Full Conversation
Mike also explains how leading the whole gym, not just one program, holds its culture together. Listen to the full episode on Spotify or watch it on YouTube. Red Belt Software helps martial arts school owners turn processes like these into repeatable systems for enrollment, follow-up and student retention.